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#70325 - 11/07/17 09:58 AM Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion
MarcosDias Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/11
Posts: 3
Loc: Portugal
Hi,

I have a straigh line with a simple axial expansion joint.
The overall expansion is 89mm. Despite the XJ nominal axial absorption is 54mm, CAESAR shows me no error.

Can you help me please?

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#70327 - 11/07/17 02:42 PM Re: Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion [Re: MarcosDias]
Faizal K Offline
Member

Registered: 07/21/08
Posts: 159
Loc: USA/Malaysia
Sounds about right if you're talking about static analysis. I don't think Caesar checks if you've exceeded manufacturer's limitations for the expansion joint for you. For that I think you either do it manually or make use of the Expansion Joint Rating module.

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#70337 - 11/08/17 05:46 AM Re: Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion [Re: Faizal K]
MarcosDias Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/11
Posts: 3
Loc: Portugal
Originally Posted By: Faizal K
Sounds about right if you're talking about static analysis. I don't think Caesar checks if you've exceeded manufacturer's limitations for the expansion joint for you. For that I think you either do it manually or make use of the Expansion Joint Rating module.


thanks for the reply!

But, if i introduce stiffness etc., that are properties of the XJ, shouldn't caesar determine if it deals with the expansion and forces associated?

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#70339 - 11/08/17 08:57 AM Re: Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion [Re: MarcosDias]
Michael_Fletcher Offline
Member

Registered: 01/29/10
Posts: 1025
Loc: Louisiana, US
When you specify pressure and area, CAESAR will calculate pressure thrust within the expansion joint, and causes it to grow accordingly. If your expansion joint has limitations on growth, i.e. it will fail if permitted to grow after X mm of growth, you need to add support to your pipe to prevent it from growing that far.

If instead, your expansion joint has tie rods, or some other self-limiting mechanism from growth, then you must model these, too.

CAESAR only sees expansion joints as spring elements that grow based on pressure and react to external stimuli. It is up to you to verify the EJ meets requirements, which there are a couple ways to do this check in CAESAR.

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#70343 - 11/08/17 10:07 AM Re: Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion [Re: MarcosDias]
MarcosDias Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/11
Posts: 3
Loc: Portugal
DEar Michael,

I'm not sure if i understood...You're saying that the XJ reacts to external stimulation, but is not reactig to the pipe expansion...

I will check Expansion Joint Rating module as Faizal suggested

Thanks

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#70356 - 11/09/17 09:40 AM Re: Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion [Re: MarcosDias]
Michael_Fletcher Offline
Member

Registered: 01/29/10
Posts: 1025
Loc: Louisiana, US
Without a screenshot available, I can't really guess as to what the problem is. However, if you have nodes 10-20-30-40, where an anchor exists at 10 and 40 and element 20-30 is an expansion joint, and a temperature defined, the expansion joint will compress despite imparting a load to the pipe at F=P*A. If you omit the anchor at node 40, the expansion joint will expand due to pressure and the pipe will expand due to thermal.

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#70358 - 11/09/17 09:43 AM Re: Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion [Re: MarcosDias]
Michael_Fletcher Offline
Member

Registered: 01/29/10
Posts: 1025
Loc: Louisiana, US
FYI, instructions to upload to the site.





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#70363 - 11/09/17 11:29 PM Re: Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion [Re: MarcosDias]
Richard Ay Offline
Member

Registered: 12/13/99
Posts: 6226
Loc: Houston, Texas, USA
CAESAR II has an expansion joint rating module, you can find this on the "Analysis" ribbon.
_________________________
Regards,
Richard Ay - Consultant

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#70370 - 11/13/17 06:46 PM Re: Pipe expansion overcome expansion joint nominal absorbtion [Re: MarcosDias]
danb Offline
Member

Registered: 04/22/05
Posts: 1453
Loc: ...
Faizal K is right
_________________________
Dan

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