Piping codes

The thought of burning trains got me a thinking.

Before I answer... are the votes anonymous or
not :-)

SLH you big Chicken eh!

Give it a shot.....

Yes, the votes are anonymous. And ...

- you can only vote once, and
- you can view the results as many times as you like after you vote.

For an explanation of the references to the <font color="#ff0000">burning train</font>, view this PowerPoint slide show .

Hey I voted BEFORE I got the answer, really.
(grin). Needs about 8 more levels to
really pinpoint the answer though.

Love the burning train reference I'll have
to add that to my library of failure information.

Really it's "education" not "rubbernecking"


-Shannon

this poll has had long enough.

Interpretations anyone??

8 people 40% answer no!

I was going to let it go till April 3rd, a full month before locking this thread. What is most interesting is that only 23 people answered the poll.

I declined to participate because I was offended by the questions.

Are you kidding?

Personally I found the questions amusing...

And I will probably mention this poll to the Members of TG B of B31.3 next week (Meeting Phoenix AZ check ASME.org for details)

My first comment is that a small number of people participated, I see the most amazing questions from all over the world in this forum but few people it seemed could bother with this poll...

My second comment is that the poll indicates that 2/3 of this small poll group, seem to have some unsettled feeling with their code knowledge!

Is this because they are:
A)Unable to read study and learn the code for one reason or another.

or because

b) The code and all its reference books published by people such as Messrs Woods and Becht is still to hard to understand?

Hello John.

The poll was in response to:

a) constantly seeing (new)people posting polls instead of questions, i thought it would be fun to create a meaningfull poll which has not been seen on this forum for a while.

b) The topic in which the (Guru's)(my observation)
disagreed about the intention of the code(s)

I personally feel that stress analysis and code compliance are two sides of the the same coin.

Maybe the questions arn't great, but i feel you either:
a) know you are able
b) think you are able
c) know you are unable.


Either way, a little tongue in cheek, but not entirely irrelevent.

I like the way you think John,
Good advice with a smile.

I would love to shoot the breeze with yourselves next time i'm in Texas. As that is highly unlikely I'll be sure to give Mr Deil a beer voucher to pass onto you, when i have the honour of attending his upcoming Dynamics lecture.

John, I'd say "unsettled feeling" is a bit
harsh (grin). Since I'm one of those poeple
in the middle group (so much for anonymous)
it's not that I'm not comfortable with what
I do. It's that I know that somewhere in
the world is the person who will say "you did
that all wrong, you should have done XXXX".

We're not all certain we know everything yet.
I'd like to think I'm at the point where I
know when to ask though. I can think of a
few people I'd put in the first category, but
it's certainly not everyone, and it's certainly
NOT all the good stress engineers.


Shannon
(yes, I can read).


Shannon


[QUOTE]Originally posted by John C. Luf:
[QB] ersonally I found the questions amusing...

(snip)

My second comment is that the poll indicates that 2/3 of this small poll group, seem to have some unsettled feeling with their code knowledge!

PS, I read the categories as
"Stress Guru who knows every last obscure detail"
"idiot"
and
"somewhere in between"

How did others read them?
=Shannon

Person with no life who studies arcane bits of stuff...

Middle of the road...

Neophyte

"I declined to participate because I was offended by the questions.

--------------------
Kevin Monroe"

I didn't decline the voting; but,I have faith in collective wisdom of the code & find the topic of the poll dangerous. We, poor people live safely by following religions, laws & codes. When need for changes arise, codes get modified.

Till then, we have to follow the same with open eyes - knowing well the intent of the code. There is more to the methods than just the steps & proper know-how, real-life or simulator training & service attitude prepares engineers to determine cause of any poblem to solve & risk of any decision taken beforehand.

regards,
sam

I'm not sure why the topic of the poll is
dangerous... I thought of it as "though
provoking"... I mentally put people who post
on this list in various categories, and
thought the results weren't surprising.

In particular, I thought the number of people
in the 3rd category (much better phrased by
Mr. Luf than myself, apologies to anyone
I might have offended) was interesting. It
seems to me that thats a case of companies
giving engineers work to do that they need
more guidance to do, and the engineer having
to balance continued employment with lack
of experience... I have certainly seen my
share of people who think that

"I know how to run the software that does XXX"

and

"I can do XXXX"

are the same thing. I think that the time spent
by the first category people on this and other
lists, at least starts people thinking about
what the differences are...


=Shannon
(taking philosopher hat off)

Hmm...you mean theres more to this pipe stress stuff than simply owning a copy of Caesar II.... your kidding right????

Codes we don't need no stinking codes..... (phrase borrowed from Bogies Movies) http://humor.about.com/library/ds/blds030403.htm

for a completer look go here...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stinking_badges

Actually the quote I've heard is

"we don't need engineers for this pipe stress stuff, we have Caesar".

Yep, scared me.
-Shannon

If I had a nickel for every engineer I've come across who thinks they know stress becuase they spent a month or two running Caesar back when they were new out of school - I'd be retired!

This topic has gotten my thicking about something - How many of us, I mean real stress guys (and gals) are there in this world? 2000? 10,000? I know we're a pretty small group, but I don't have a good feel for just how small.

My guesstimate 50e3 out of the world’s population of 6,505,523,636 or 7.68e-10% of the worlds population, based on extrapolation of known data on one pipe stress program...

My experience has 9 out of 10 people not being trustworthy of doing the work unsupervised but perhaps I'm too harsh!

Overall a very small group….

Sir,

Nowhere people advocate unsupervized work - always check column is populated by sign. If someone signs without checking the stress calcs, this real stress person owns the work of analyst- right or wrong.

regards,
sam

Yes the need for a competent checker is paramount at all times and hopefully they will be that 1 out of 10 person!

I've seen a lot of "blind leading the blind" in
stress work checking. My preference is to
use the category 3 person to do the work and
the category 1 (or 2 depending on the problem)
person to check the work... but I've seen a lot
more of the reverse.

-Shannon

Dear Shannon,

I accept what you wrote about quality of checking personnel in piping stress work.

But, customers themselves can be blamed for that. Insist on checking resume of people before workshare or outsource - their education & real experience. Don't believe unknown private engineering colleages - many are sub-standard.


regards,
sam